Kajabi Vs With Regard To

kajabi-review

Kajabi started as a simple idea of Kenny Reuter wanting to begin a side business teaching people to make toys online. Although he was not that passionate about teaching people online, he was passionate about making it easier for people to sell their knowledge online.

The vision was simple. Kajabi founders Kenny Rueter and Travis Rosser knew they wanted to help people monetize their knowledge and premium digital content online. They needed a platform that made it easy for entrepreneurs to do this.

Kajabi is a popular online course creator. It is one of the most widely used online learning platforms. Since its launch in 2010, Kajabi grew to become the powerhouse that it is today. It has empowered thousands to escape the jobs that no longer fulfill them and help them realize their dreams.

This overview will provide a basic understanding of Kajabi. This includes online course creation, marketing, pricing, and so much more. With this, you will have a good idea of what you will get should you choose Kajabi as your platform.

kajabi-logo

For those of you who prefer a more visual experience, here is a video review from Lane Sebring’s YouTube channel. To get a comprehensive overview of Kajabi, you may still want to check out our article below.

General Overview Kajabi Vs With Regard To

Pros

  • A highly integrated platform featuring a lot of built-in tools
  • Intuitive marketing tools that help you promote and sell your products.
  • User-friendly
  • Amazing customer service
  • Intuitive course builder and highly customizable themes
  • Uses Wistia as a video host

Cons

  • Kajabi pricing is higher than average prices
  • Students cannot be issued custom certificates of completion by users on the platform.
  • Assessment customization is limited.

What is Kajabi?

Kajabi is an online platform for creating courses that allow users to manage their businesses from one location. Kajabi can take care of everything, from course creation to marketing and much more.

How does Kajabi work?

Kajabi is built to sell. It boasts how simple it is to use. You can start by purchasing a plan. You have three options: Basic, Growth, and Pro. We will discuss them later in this review.

Once you have selected a plan, you can easily set up your account and upload your content. You can upload your video lectures, give lesson titles and descriptions using the lesson editor.

You can easily complete assessments by simply typing the questions and selecting the options (if you’ve chosen the multiple-choice option).

Now you can market your products. In Kajabi, you can build pipelines. These mechanisms allow you to achieve high conversion rates by turning prospects into potential students by giving efficient marketing funnels. You can add landing pages, freebies that get leads to enter their email addresses, video marketing, and so on.

Once the prospect is enrolled as a student, payments can be made through the site. All without having to leave Kajabi. Kajabi Vs With Regard To

Now, some features make Kajabi an almost “all-in-one” platform. These features will be discussed in the next sections. But, Kajabi can go head-to-head and over most online course platforms with the features and benefits it offers.

Why choose Kajabi?

You want to maximize your investment as an entrepreneur. If you have valuable content that you would like to market, Kajabi provides excellent support for your needs. This guide will help you launch your business and keep it growing.

The business is more than just uploading your course content and waiting for students to sign in. It requires you to build out a curriculum, develop assessments or goals for your students, design your course website, and market it to your target audience. Kajabi allows you to do all of these things and more.

  • Build a website
  • Make course offerings
  • Keep track of student progress
  • Manage subscriptions/payments
  • Run email marketing campaigns

Kajabi’s price is one thing that has been criticized. Admittedly, it is pricier than some alternatives. But, take into account that this takes away the hassle of using expensive plug-ins for your business. There is also the added stress of figuring out how to seamlessly make these plug-ins work with each other. This takes time, effort, and money. All this could be avoided by using one platform.

Good platforms think of what their users want and need. These platforms can be used to create sales pages, email your students, or do all kinds of marketing activities.

If you are a professional looking for ways to market your knowledge, Kajabi is the right choice. It’s a powerful all-in-one solution for creating, marketing, and selling online courses.

Kajabi: A Beginner-Friendly Tool

Many great teachers don’t have the technology skills to share their knowledge online. Even with the willingness of some to learn, the process can be complex and confusing too. Kajabi creators created the platform so that it is accessible and easy to understand even for those with problems with computer work.

It uses a visual layout which makes it easy to use and intuitive. Even without learning how to code, you will be able to create an online business in no time with Kajabi through its drag-and-drop editor.

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Almost “all-in-one”

Kajabi can be used for most things, with the exception of a few features that are still being developed by developers. You don’t need to spend too much time trying to find the right extensions or plug-ins. Imagine, one update could cause these plug-ins to disrupt your business processes.

If you want to save yourself the headache, Kajabi already has excellent tools for creating landing pages and sales funnels and converting visitors into customers. This platform allows you to create courses and market them. To entice students to your courses, you can offer discounts, follow up leads, and manage payments from the Kajabi website.

Kajabi’s email marketing and funnel creations are a great fit for me as a busy entrepreneur. I could easily automate follow-up sequences, and it’s effortless to do too. Kajabi Vs With Regard To

Overall, Kajabi fulfills more than other platforms can do with what it offers.

Tutorials

For people who are complete beginners, there could be some doubt on the truthfulness of this “easy-to-use” claim. But they will be pleasantly surprised to find out that it is indeed true.

Kajabi offers a lot of support to its users. First, the Kajabi Assistant Bar provides access to a lot of searchable tutorials. Just head to the top and enter any query. It will display related tutorials.

Second, under the Kajabi University, you can check out a catalog of tutorials and videos to get you started with creating and developing your business. Some of these topics cover creating your online courses, marketing your products on social media and other platforms, and setting up payments.

These tutorials come in both video and text format for your convenience.

The third and most important feature of the onboarding process, is the 28-day Hero Challenge. It is basically a month-long crash program to help you launch your website and make your first sale. This challenge will teach you everything about the platform and give you strategies to market your products.

If your queries aren’t answered, Kajabi has one of the best customer support out there. If you are a member of the Growth or Pro Plan you will have access to live chat support 24 hours a day. Customer chat support is only available during business hours for Basic Plans. Despite this, the support team responds very quickly. I have had no problems so far with their handling of things.

Kajabi also offers a rewards program that provides incentives to creators who achieve their revenue goals and includes some exclusive perks.

Customer Support

If you have got a query that cannot be found in the Kajabi online guides, the next thing you can do is contact customer service. So, if you are stuck on an issue, you can always rely on them to provide you with the answers. Kajabi Vs With Regard To

With the Growth and Pro Plan, you can access the 24/7 Kajabi customer support team live chat.

Although, if you opt for the Basic Plan, the staff will only be available on Mondays to Fridays from 9 am to 7 pm. Although it functions as a ticket system you will receive an answer within one day. They always respond promptly, even with this. They never take too long to reply.

If you’re not confident in your computer skills, the more expensive plans can be worth it. The other two Kajabi plans offer around-the-clock access to support, while the Basic Plan does not.

How to use Kajabi:

Creating a Class:

Kajabi’s course creation is quick, easy, and customizable. Once you provide a name for the product, head over to the upper right side of your screen, and you can see “New Product.” There are 3 pre-built product blueprints for various digital products. You can also create your own listing. Let’s go through them one by one:

  • Mini-course
    • Although it contains less material than the Online Courses, a mini-course is very easy to complete. This can be used to gauge customer interest as well as build your brand’s value.
  • Online course
    • From short workshops to seminars to lectures about your area of expertise, these are full-blown courses that your students can avail.
  • Evergreen Training
    • The Evergreen Course will help you keep your product in front of people and make sales. Essentially, after you launch it, it will keep creating passive income for you. Marketing aside, this option allows you to trickle feed your content to your students and keep them interested.
  • Blank
    • This is an excellent option if you are an advanced user who wants to customize your content.

Kajabi Vs With Regard To

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To upload your courses, you can use Kajabi’s intuitive editor. These can be uploaded from your computer, Dropbox, or Google Drive.

Kajabi supports many file types. You can add audio, video, pdf and text files to your lessons. Wistia offers video hosting for Kajabi. You can also upload bulk files. Kajabi Vs With Regard To

How to Upload Your Content

Videos

Kajabi provides built-in streaming through Wistia as a video host. There will be an icon that you can spot immediately, and it will ask you to upload either a video or an assessment.

As mentioned earlier, you will be able to upload your videos in bulk without worrying about bandwidth. All Pricing Plans at Kajabi include unlimited bandwidth. Uploads can be made from your computer, Dropbox or Google Drive. You can also upload via URL links. However, take note that it would not accept URLs from Youtube or Vimeo as the uploader looks for the file type in the URL.

After your files are uploaded, Kajabi will automatically convert them into articles you can edit later. This saves you the hassle of going through the posts and uploading videos one by one.

With Wistia being the video host, your subscription will be worth it. A standalone Wistia subscription can set you back at $99 per month. If you take a look at the cost, with $20 more, you can already get Kajabi’s Basic Plan at $119/year with its features. This is a great bargain.

Assessments

Assessments are great tools to gauge student learning and engagement. When they can see how well they are doing with their lessons, the students can determine whether or not they understand the course material. This can motivate them to work harder. You can also use this feature to get feedback from students about your products and if you opt for content locking.

It takes less than two minutes. Open the People tab in the Dashboard to create assessments. Select Assessments, then +New Assessment, and follow the prompt to start customizing.

A nifty feature is that when students do not fully succeed on the assessments, it can be set to automatically send out additional materials to help them.

There are some limitations. First, I have observed that the user cannot include both a video and an assessment under the same category.

Second, it does not allow users to randomize the questions or have question banks. Although, it does support assessments such as multiple-choice questions and paragraph-style questions.

Students can also upload files to be checked through the assignment submission feature.

Photos

For your lessons, you can upload a poster photo. Pictures help to set the tone for your website and give your students a visual preview.

You can easily upload images by clicking on the Pick File button on the right side of the editor.

Certificates

Kajabi is almost an “all-in” platform. This is due to its inability to provide certificates to students who have completed the courses. While Kajabi does allow creators to give out certificates of completion, you cannot make them onsite.

To create these certificates, you would have to rely on third-party services like Canva, Google Slides, Accredible, or SmartDraw.

Personally, I do not mind this for my business, but some would find it a minor hassle.

Another thing, Kajabi does not indicate the amount of time spent studying the courses or any continuing education credit. This can be a huge deal for people who wish to choose eLearning to earn credit. I think that the Kajabi creators should highly consider this.

Downloads

Even if we call it online students, some do not necessarily stay online for the whole duration of the course. Some students download course materials and complete tasks offline. This feature was added by Kajabi to make things easier for students. This can be found in the Downloads section on the right side of the page.

Students will be able download any material that you have placed while they are in a lesson.

Body

You can choose to add a description or even a transcript for your videos. Some students prefer to read transcripts rather than watching entire videos when they review.

If you choose to only add a description, it will help students know what the lesson is all about and what topics will be discussed in the video. Kajabi Vs With Regard To

Student Interactions

Community

It would be wonderful for eLearning platforms to allow members and students to interact with one another and discuss topics in their course materials. This is similar to what they would do in a classroom setting. Over the years, some have utilized Facebook groups, but that would require you to join Facebook and apply for the group membership.

Conveniently, you do not need to exit Kajabi to interact with your students and with each other. Kajabi offers a fully integrated feature called Community. This is one of their student engagement tools.

You can even set your Community behind a paywall for patrons to gain access. This Community will allow you to directly address student queries and give students the chance to do the same with each other.

Because you can make the Community available as a standalone product. You can also buy access to the discussions for those who don’t want to purchase the whole course.

Organizing Your Topics

One problem that forums have is the lack of organization. Both the students and the creators may find it difficult to keep track of particular topics. This is something I noticed in many Facebook groups. This makes it difficult to understand your audience and listen to them.

Kajabi allows the administrator to organize and reorganize feeds. They can sort the posts by topic and also ‘pin’ specific posts for better viewability.

Overall, Kajabi’s Community feature is a significant advantage over its competition. This feature is very beneficial to entrepreneurs who run an online school.

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Content Access

Kajabi allows you to choose how your students will receive your courses. You can either allow them to receive all the classes and resources at once, drip-feed them on a schedule, or lock your content. The last one tends to increase student engagement as there is a requirement to finish the lesson first before accessing the next one. Kajabi Vs With Regard To

Dripping Course Content

You can choose to drip-feed your courses after a pre-set duration instead of allowing your students to receive everything all at once.

When you drip-feed your content, you can keep your student interested in returning to your page to check for new content. This will also prevent your student from skipping important parts of the course.

Third, it is a valuable feature for when you decide on a membership type.

Content Locking

Your student must complete a lesson before they can access the next. An assessment can be given at the end of lessons. This way, they increase their participation, and you can keep track of their progress in understanding lesson materials.

Course Analytics

Kajabi is proud to offer the best tools for entrepreneurs to manage their businesses with the course analytics. It creates heatmaps and videos stats. Through it, you will get insights on which aspects of your courses are doing well and which ones need to improve on.

It also provides information about your affiliates, students, sales transactions, and other relevant information that could help you optimize your products.

Play Rate

The play rate gives data on how many people have watched a specific video. Early on, I mentioned how some students opt to read the transcript of the video and download the course material rather than watching.

Average Engagement

This data shows you the average percentage of video your students watched. Since some students prefer to skip some segments of the video, you can get an idea of how well you can keep your students engaged in what you need to say.

Visual Engagement Viewer

This will create a graphic overlay for your video. This is a great feature for visual learners like me. Information presented in text blocks is not the best way to process it. I prefer having my data in graph form.

The Visual Engagement Viewer displays a report on your students’ engagement with specific parts of the video. Usually, there is a general downhill trend wherein people tend to stop watching at the start of the outro.

Viewer Heatmaps

Your students may not be watching your videos just because they opened them. They could have kept it running in the background while they do something else, in the guise of multi-tasking. Kajabi Vs With Regard To

With the Viewer Heatmap, you can now check which segments of the viewers were not that interesting to your students and which parts they repeatedly watched. It could mean that these are parts that they found interesting or they found difficult. Thus, there was a need to rewatch to review.

You can trust that Kajabi will provide you with a valuable array of analytic tools to better your content. Your data can be used to create a strategy that will guide your business decisions.

Blogging

Strong blogs can make a big difference in promoting your company. Current students can receive updates and more information about your products and services while new customers are introduced to them. A solid blog can increase traffic and generate leads that could lead to potential students.

Kajabi still has a lot to do in this area, however. This is not as good as WordPress. Despite its limitations, Kajabi’s ability to store everything in one place makes up for them.

Basic HTML Know-How

It is unnecessary for you to code to build your website and customize most things in Kajabi; it is still a good idea.

If you want to personalize the photos in your Kajabi blog, you need to do some basic coding. Uploading a photo to a blog post will display it in the recommended size. Kajabi works with HTML. To change certain dimensions, you would need to play with HTML. This isn’t too difficult. You can find many tutorials for basic coding by doing a quick internet search.

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Another thing that would probably concern you is text wrapping. Without HTML, you cannot change the way text wraps around images in your blog.

Kajabi does not have an image bank. If you wanted to add a photo that you have previously used in other articles, you would need to upload it from your computer or sites like Google Drive again. Hopefully, Kajabi will focus on these things in their subsequent updates.

Tagging

While I enjoy most of Kajabi’s features, one thing that gripes me is the hassle of being unable to pick from existing tags in my post. Unlike in other blogs where you can easily refer to previous tags, the tags themselves don’t appear even as suggestions when you type them down.

It can be a hassle to remember the tag you used, or to put it on a separate list for each blog post. Kajabi Vs With Regard To

Marketing Tools

These are Kajabi’s most vital support for its users. Kajabi is built to sell. Your business will be safe with so many marketing tools. There are automation, pipelines and many other features. In this section, we will discuss a few features.

Pipelines

Kajabi has developed a platform that makes it easy to sell and market. The name itself refers to Kajabi’s goal of transforming the same number of leads to the same number of paying customers. You can have three, fifteen or 100 pipelines depending on which Price Plan you choose.

Kajabi will provide you with a visual representation for your schematics. Editing is simple and intuitive. You can add videos, images and offers using the drag-and-drop editor. This will help you increase your conversion rates. If you do not know where to begin, suggestions are also provided.

Kajabi offers some blueprints for its pipelines so that you do not need to start from scratch. The blueprint you choose will help you set up funnels including landing pages, email automation and offers. This template was carefully crafted by Brendon Burchard, one of the world’s leading high-performance coaches.

With the Pipeline Stats feature, you can monitor the progress of your marketing plans and use it to evaluate the areas that are lagging. This feature allows you to see each page and email of the pipeline and data on your earnings per view.

Affiliate Program

A disclaimer here: the affiliate program is only available with the Growth and Pro Plans. Now, you and your partners can efficiently market your goods and with the program. It becomes easier for you to give them the agreed-upon commission. A private dashboard will be available to you. In it, you can see statistics of clicks, conversions, and other pertinent data to help you market your business.

Automation

Email Marketing

Kajabi is your business made easy. Depending on your schedules, you can launch email marketing campaigns quickly. This feature allows you to decide on the sequence of the mails, add multiple emails to be sent out in the set sequence, and upsell additional offers. You can also use templates to suit your email purpose. This freedom is not available in many other options.

Suppose a visitor adds something to their cart but has not yet decided to make the purchase final; you can set up Kajabi to send an email to remind them of your offer. This allows you to track sign-ups automatically from your email campaigns. Just relax and see the improvement in your conversion rates.

You can also use Kajabi to integrate with other email platforms.

Marketing Partners

You can run your business under one platform, and Kajabi’s integrations help make that happen. Currently, Kajabi has 10 native integrations. To name a few, it has ConvertKit, Aweber, MailChimp, and Active Campaign. Kajabi Vs With Regard To

How to Price Your Products

There are several factors that you need to consider when pricing your courses – time spent in planning the content and creating it, charging for your expertise, operational costs, and so on.

Once you have determined the price, Kajabi gives a simple method for pricing your products. Head over to the Offers tab found on the left side and click ‘Add New Offer.’

You can sell them individually or package them as a set. Once you make a new deal, you will receive a prompt to enter the title offers, product, and cost. Now, you will only be able to choose one product, but there will be some options for you to choose from in terms of bundles and payment options on the following pages. You can also decide on the currency of your product’s price.

If you are worried about people not being able to afford your course, you can set it up in multiple ways:

  • Free
  • One-time Payment
  • Multiple Payments
  • Recurring Payments

You can also generate coupon codes, bulk coupons codes and special offers to apply to your coupon from this page.

Payment Methods

Kajabi uses Stripe and Paypal for payment processing. You can customize your checkout to create flexible payment options and offer custom payment options for students. Kajabi doesn’t charge transaction fees so this comes with the convenience. But, you do have to answer to the cost of its payment method partners.

One convenient thing about partnering with Paypal is that it makes it easier to pay affiliates their commissions through Paypal Mass Pay with an exported list of all your affiliate sales.

Refunds are also made more straightforward. Kajabi allows you to do refunds without needing to leave the site.

Kajabi Pricing

As mentioned earlier, Kajabi’s pricing can seem higher than other platforms. Because of the platform’s cost, most individuals would undoubtedly be hesitant to use it. 

Kajabi is a never-ending investment. Kajabi is not just a course-building platform. Even though it’s a bit more expensive than other platforms, keep in mind that you do not need to pay separately for three or more different tools for email services, blogs, and sales pipelines. All of these come with your Kajabi subscription. Because of the extensive tool set, prices are greater than those of competitors. But, Kajabi still provides the best value for money out of all other platforms.

All three pricing plans offer unlimited bandwidth, unlimited video hosting via Wistia, and 0% transaction fees. It also has chat support and assessment features. 

Below is a detailed breakdown of each pricing plan to see how they differ. Kajabi Vs With Regard To

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Basic Plan

The lowest-priced plan starts at $149 monthly. You will only have to pay $119 if you are billed annually. 

The basic plan is the most affordable option. Take note, it limits you to only 3 products, 1 website, 3 sales pipelines, and around a thousand members. The Kajabi logo branding will remain on all products. 

However, landing pages and marketing emails are unlimited. The Basic Plan might not contain some of the essential marketing tools you would like to use for your business. Despite Kajabi’s superb customer service, you’ll want to keep your questions to office hours. In contrast to the higher plans, who gets access to a live chat with customer care 24/7. 

Growth Plan

You can subscribe to this tier for $50 extra and get five times the number of courses. The monthly price is $199, but if you pay it annually, it will just be $159. 

Fortunately, though, even the basic pricing plan has a lot of features to play with. Most plans have the same basic suite of functions, but they scale according to the pricing plan. For example, the Basic plan only allows for 3 products and 3 pipelines, while the Growth plan allows for 15 products and 15 pipelines. So when you buy a higher-tier plan, you are not paying for new functions but expanding the ones you already have. Kajabi also doesn’t charge a transaction fee for any sales made on the site.

The second level allows you to create more products and pipelines as well as members. More reasons to get this plan: white-labeling, affiliate marketing, and automation. 

  • White-labelling – With this, you can remove Kajabi branding from your website and fully make it your own. 
  • Affiliate advertising – well-known online sales strategy. Your products will reach a bigger audience thanks to your affiliates. For suggesting your products to their audiences, your affiliates will be paid commissions. 
  • Automation – Automation, as previously said, makes it easy for you to follow up with your students. The system then uses a prompt to automatically send out the predetermined response. If a student is falling behind on examinations, for example, you can send them an automatic email with extra course materials. There’s no need for you to manually follow their progress. 

As a creator, we are aware that you are not in the business to only make money. You want your products to be of value as well. Business-wise, this is valuable because if people are getting their bang for the buck, they will be more likely to return for more. It is a win-win situation. 

Pro Plan 

{This is the priciest plan Kajabi has to offer. But it does come with some pretty neat features. You can market up to 100 products, handle 3 sites and at most, have 20,000 members. Because of the number of courses you can market, you can have 25 admin users to help you manage. You also have access to round-the-clock customer support.|This is the most expensive plan offered by Kajabi. It does, however, have some interesting features. You can sell up to 100 products, manage three websites, and have a maximum of 20,000 members. You can have up to 25 admin users to assist you in regulating the amount of courses you can market. You also get access to customer service 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. 

These features plus all features you would enjoy from both Basic and Growth Plans are included. While there are unlimited landing pages, the advertising emails are limited to two million. 

A bonus to getting the Pro Plan is access to the Experts Academy. In it, you will find more information on how to market your brand. Kajabi Vs With Regard To

If you chose Kajabi’s Pro Plan, you could set billing monthly for $399 or yearly for $319. Take note, this is a massive investment that you would need to consider. Most big companies or those with a good amount of courses to sell choose this option. But if you are just starting or your business does not warrant the need for a Pro Plan yet, then I would suggest the other two plans. Just my two cents in. You would still get to enjoy a lot of what Kajabi has to offer on the budget you set. 

Moving to Kajabi

If you’re not new to course creation, you’ve probably utilized various platforms. It’s fantastic that you’re still researching company choices and looking for ways to improve. If you have decided to move to Kajabi, another concern would be how to move all of your data into the platform. 

Not to worry, though. Fortunately, you can simply import your members’ names and email using a .csv file. But, you can only do this 500 members at a time. So it would require you to do multiple importations if needed. 

Another thing to keep in mind is that owing to a security issue, your members will need to reset their passwords. This is excellent news for you and your colleagues. Kajabi is concerned about the safety of your company. This means that after the switch is done, other platforms will no longer have access to their information. 

Conclusion

Kajabi is a popular choice for many creators, and it has a lot to offer to your business for the price you choose to pay. It has excellent support, a well-integrated system, and is highly beginner-friendly. 

As stated earlier, Kajabi aims to help you streamline your business process in one site and make it profitable. With its many marketing features, it gives you the edge to push your products to new heights. 

Now, this review has given you some insight into the benefits and downsides of choosing Kajabi. Overall, I can still say that Kajabi is a wonderful tool to manage your business from creation to marketing. Kajabi Vs With Regard To

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Frequently Asked Questions: Kajabi Vs With Regard To

  • What does Kajabi mean?

    • According to its founders, it is an aboriginal word that means “to take flight.” 
  • Is Kajabi free?

    • Currently, Kajabi does not offer a free plan. However, it provides a 14-day trial for you to try out its features. 
  • Is Kajabi worth the money?

    • This depends on your business needs and how you can optimize Kajabi’s features. Kajabi is well known for being user-friendly and having a variety of built-in integrations for smoother business processes. You also receive excellent support. 
  • Is Kajabi easy to use?

    • Yes. Kajabi is easy to use. In fact, because of this, thousands of course creators have it as their platform of choice. 
  • Is Kajabi accessible via a mobile app?

    • Yes. Your students have the convenience of accessing Kajabi via a mobile app. It is available in both iOS and Google Play. 
  • Can you use your domain? 

    • Yes. You may establish a custom domain using Kajabi’s branding with the Basic Plan (yourdomaintitle.kajabi.com). You can choose to remove any traces of Kajabi’s branding and create a website that is purely focused on you with the Growth and Pro Plans. 
  • Does Kajabi have transaction fees?

    • No. There are no transaction fees, but you can still be subject to pay the standard Stripe merchant processing fee. 
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